Fair View House in Hirael

[Ellen Greaves]

Been trying to find more information about Fair View House in Hirael. I have the 1881 census records but cannot find anything else about it. I know it stood roughly where the old Dairy on Ambrose st, further back in the area between the backs of Friar\'s Avenue and Fair View road (where I live). It sounds an imposing house, according to the 1881 census at elat 9 - 10 families lived there from all walks of life. It sounds a very interesting place. A friend and i are also trying to find out more about her house, 30 Friars Avenue, and any stories surrounding the property. We have the census records telling us who lived there from 1885 onwards, roughly the year they were built, same as my house in Fiar View Road. But again I cannot find much else. Wondered if you can recommend any local books that may shed more light on this area. I would appreciate any help to point us in the right direction.

[Admin (Matt)]

- deleted - contents merged with post below

[Admin (Matt)]

http://www.old-maps.co.uk/maps.html

The 1889 Town Map I think shows a "Dye Works" on the site, but later maps remove that title and by the 1930's that building has gone too. The dye house appears more South (toward the City Centre) on the plot so it might be that the site was acquired and house demolished then?

John Woods 1834 Map showing the house...
http://www.bangorcivicsociety.org.uk/pages/hisso/i2.htm

Show's it as the residence of Mr Ambrose

(Some info on William Ambrose here: http://wbo.llgc.org.uk/en/s-AMBR-WIL-1813.html)

[Admin (Matt)]

Funeral of the Rev William Ambrose 1873

[Admin (Matt)]

George James was a native of Bangor, born around 1811.



In Pigots 1835 directory his Chemists business shows as being on Market Street - which is the section of the high street we know today as running from the Cathedral to the City Clock. He was only aged 24 at this point.

George clearly went through a bad patch. Aged 30-40 bankrupcy proceedings plagued him. The Chemist business isn't found in directories after 1835.

 1841

 1851

In 1851 he appears as a 39 year old 'Agent' living in 25 Mount Street, Bangor - his mothers home address. Interestingly at this point he is a widower. At the same time Elizabeth Ambrose (Wife to John, mother to William) by that time was a 75 year old widow running Fairview as a lodging house, she died in 1853.

George did remarry to Anne (4 years his junior) they had a daughter called Harriet Elizabeth James and a son Charles James who became the Registrar of Births & Deaths for the district.

Between 1853 - 1857 despite his wows George appears to have found his way back to some wealth, and into Fairview where he continues the lodging house keeper role.


1857 - Marriage of Miss Pennant and Col Hogg of 1st Life Guards

In the 1871 census George is engaged in employment merely as a 'Gentleman'.


1873


By 1881 the family appear to have downsized to 8 Plas Llwyd Terrace where his profession is disclosed as a retired chemist. At the same time the residents of Fair View House exploded in number with ten families with lowly trades. That said Plas Llwyd Terrace was still a substantial house and relatively newly built. Today Plas Llwyd runs to 12 in number due to some being flats, but back then there was 8 - 8 likely being last/end house to the top next to Bangor Mountain.  

(As above) the 1889 Town map appears to show "Fair View" house having been demolished and a Dye Works erected nearby,possibly related to the below 1887 advert


By 1891 George was 80 years old  and was living at his son Charles' home address 31 High Street which is in the town houses attached to the left of the British Hotel. There he is described as living by his own means, sadly widowed from Ann by this point.

 George died a year later, 16th January 1892, recorded as having moved to 31 Victoria Place, Bangor (Unless this was another name for Charles' house - as that was 31 too). His personal effects totalled £283 3s 6d which today would equate to around £17,000.

[Admin (Matt)]

Maybe William Street was named after William Ambrose (Emrys)? Johns son.

It would have been renamed as in 1834 it was known as Lewis Street. There was a William Street in Dean at that time, which became Brick Street.

[Admin (Matt)]

Friars Road and William St were built by 1900 following the release of a triangular plot next to the Friars estate by the Penrhyn Estate (known as Cae Session) to Evan Williams a builder from Garth. He built the two terraces fronting the street at a density of 27 houses to the acre.

A push for improved living conditions saw terraces decrease in density so by 1913 the addition of Orme Road and Friars Avenue saw the appearance of small front gardens and service alleyways. Land had been acquired from the Fair View and Friars School Estates.  

[1891 Census shows Evan Williams 57 - Building Contractor at 17 Garth Road, Married to Sarah with 5 sons an three daughters. He built amongst many other buildings Glannada School in 1888 which was damaged in an arson attack in 2011 and the University Hall opened in 1897]

[Ellen]

Thanks for all this Matt, you certainly have been busy.  I had found the census records and BMDs but hadn't gotten as far the directories.  we need more detailed maps, I will have a look and see if I can find any throughout the 1800s.

[Admin (Matt)]

No worries, all good fun.

We're still a bit weak on the building itself and John Ambrose.

There is a map "Captain Johnson's 1854 map" which is referenced in Cadws research into Listed Buildings. I've never seen the map. I will add a better image from 1834 shortly.

[Admin (Matt)]

John Ambrose was the tenant of the Penrhyn Arms after 1813 succeeding William Hughes who look the post back in 1799. In addition to the Penrhyn Arms he also took tennancy of Penrhyn Shop, Penrhyn Public House and the "Terrace House". He left the Penrhyn Arms in 1823 and went to live at the Terrace House (opposite) fitting it up as a boarding house at some point thereafter removing to Fair View. [Caernarvonshire Historical Transactions 1949 v10 p40]

[Admin (Matt)]

Some C20 images of the site from picture postcards...

[David Price]

It’s not clear when Fair View House was built, but in the North Wales Chronicle, 6 January 1831, there’s an advert for the sale of a newly-erected house of eleven rooms opposite FAIR VIEW and 'bounding on the main street leading to Hirael and now in the occupation of William Price'.

On 21 May 1839, the Chronicle advertised that Fair View – a ‘genteel residence’ was to be let -  lately occupied by Mr. Ambrose.   It seems that by 1840 the house was occupied by Colonel Charles Warren.  His second son (also Charles) was born at Fair View baptised 7 Feb 1840.  Both father and son were quite notable – see the Oxford Dictionary of National Biography.  The Colonel, later Major General Sir Charles Warren (1798-1866) was the third son of John Warren, Dean of Bangor and served in the army in India, South Africa, China and the Crimea. He was the last person to be buried at Tanyfynwent graveyard.  Sir Charles Warren (1840-1927) was an army officer, an archaeologist in Palestine and in 1886 became a rather controversial Chief Commissioner of the Metropolitan Police.

During the 1882 typhoid epidemic in Bangor, Fair View, described at the time as a very large unoccupied house, was fitted up as a hospital for 24 patients – a controversial move considering the high population density of Hirael and Dean Street.
 
It seems that the present houses in Fair View Road were built about 1879/80.  The Sale Catalogue for the sale of part of the Penrhyn Estate in 1928, includes the sale of the Freehold Reversions on the houses in Fair View Road.  Houses with odd numbers had leases dated November 1879 whilst those with even numbers were dated November 1880.

The best starting point for working out the dates of any urban development in Bangor is Dr. Peter Ellis Jones’s wonderful PhD thesis, Bangor, ‘A study in Urban Morphology.... ‘. There’s a copy in the Reference Section of Bangor Public Library - you have to ask for it at the desk.  It’s incredibly detailed.  There’s no index, so narrow down your search by looking at the list of chapters (contents page).
At Bangor University Library Archives, look at the catalogue of the Carter Vincent Papers.  Also at the BU Archives, see the Bangor Rate Books for 1836, 1838 and 1852, also the Register of Occupiers 1882.  These will supplement the info in the Census, and give you the name of the proprietor.
 

 

[David Price]

[Admin (Matt)]

Following thanks to David Price


1840


1890


1913

[Ambrose_family]

To build on what has already been written :


May 1 1839      Advert to rent out the house – interesting that it says it was “lately” occupied by Mr Ambrose
March 13 1840 John Ambrose died
1841 Census     Fair View  Elizabeth Ambrose (first name on the list, John Ambrose's widow) and nine other occupants. Her occupation appears to be listed as independent means
Aug 20 1844      Mrs. Warren remained at the house, during the absence of her husband in China, then moved to London to join him
1851  Census     Fair View  Elizabeth Ambrose (first name on the list) and nine other occupants. Her occupation is Lodging House Keeper. The other occupations vary including bankers clerk, civil engineer, accountant, independent minister and servant.
February 13 1853  Catherine Ambrose’s death at Fairview

Possibly the Warren's bought the property and let it to the Ambrose family who had already got experience in running hospitality establishments.